Good Morning. I've been bouncing around on this site for a few weeks now reading the posts and getting a feel. I have purchased both books and have skimmed through them and reading TB1 now. I plan on starting in on my program starting the 21/22nd of this month (after vacation) and am looking for some insights, suggestions, thoughts from y'all.
I am currently attending graduate school before heading back to the regular Army life. That being said, I have much more freedom to develop my fitness programming without all that pesky PT to contend with.
Here's what I am thinking:
Focus from now thru the end of the year on strength and power with some minimal cardio supplementation.
Transition in January to more of a blended routine upping my HIC and E while continuing to improve strength.
Thoughts?
For my pure strength building phase I am debating on Operator or Zulu and how I should program those days.
*I have the time to add in WPU any day as I am not restricted in my training time.
Operator (1 HIC per week, 1 LSS every week or 2)
Mon - DL, Sq, Bench
Tues - WPU w/HIC, LSS or Walking Cardio
Wed - Sq, Bench, Power Cleans
Thurs - WPU w/HIC, LSS or Walking Cardio
Fri - Sq, Bench, DL or Cleans
Sat - HIC/LSS/Walking Cardio
Zulu (1 HIC per week, 1 LSS every week or 2)
M/Th - Squat, WPU
T - DL, Bench
Th - Power Clean, Bench
Wed - LSS or HIC
Sat - LSS or HIC
Zulu Option 2
M/Th - Squat, Bench, WPU
T/Fr - DL, Cleans
Wed / Sat - LSS or HIC
These are just a few variations I am toying with but am open to suggestions for improvement to my planning. I Appreciate everyone's expertise and guidance on this.
Training Protocol Guidance
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BlackPyjamas
- Posts: 137
- Joined: Sat Sep 10, 2016 2:52 am
Re: Training Protocol Guidance
I say this gently, but I don't really understand this type of question. How can we give you advice without knowing anything about you? Are you male/female? Age? Training goal? What are your current numbers? What do you want to know exactly, which template we prefer for you? I'd kindly suggest reading both books thoroughly...and then posting up clear easy to understand questions. "Thoughts?" isn't a question, without a reference point.
Re: Training Protocol Guidance
Sorry about that. I fully get what you are saying. Here's a bit more detail that may be of help to y'all in helping me get started right.
I'm a 36 y/o male serving in the Army. Like I said in my first post - I am fortunate enough to be attending graduate school full time right now so I have free reign to decide how to physical fitness without Army PT in the mix.
My training goals right now are primarily to increase strength and power. I will shift this goal come ~January to a more blended focus but right now, it's purely about moving weight and getting stronger with a maintenance mix of conditioning.
My squat is currently at 275, bench at 210, and my deadlift at 315lbs. I can do ~5 strict pullups for 3 sets (not weighted).
What I was hoping to get some feedback on is how I should/could structure my programming for strength gain. I have the time to train 5-6 days a week at upwards of 2 hours a session (although I don't plan on that) ie. time is not a concern. The examples I posted were just that - examples. I created them by reading through the forums and seeing what other people were doing, plus from what I have read in the book thus far. I fully intend to read both books, but with that being said... I will be starting on the 21st after vacation and will not have finished the books by then. I will tweek as I go if I find something to be off from the principles.
I'm a 36 y/o male serving in the Army. Like I said in my first post - I am fortunate enough to be attending graduate school full time right now so I have free reign to decide how to physical fitness without Army PT in the mix.
My training goals right now are primarily to increase strength and power. I will shift this goal come ~January to a more blended focus but right now, it's purely about moving weight and getting stronger with a maintenance mix of conditioning.
My squat is currently at 275, bench at 210, and my deadlift at 315lbs. I can do ~5 strict pullups for 3 sets (not weighted).
What I was hoping to get some feedback on is how I should/could structure my programming for strength gain. I have the time to train 5-6 days a week at upwards of 2 hours a session (although I don't plan on that) ie. time is not a concern. The examples I posted were just that - examples. I created them by reading through the forums and seeing what other people were doing, plus from what I have read in the book thus far. I fully intend to read both books, but with that being said... I will be starting on the 21st after vacation and will not have finished the books by then. I will tweek as I go if I find something to be off from the principles.
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Green2Blue
- Posts: 651
- Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2016 9:17 pm
Re: Training Protocol Guidance
At the end of the day none of this matters, you train however you want. It's your training. That being said, are you sure you want to do TB? TB is a balanced approach, and you said your main goal is strength and power. That's fine, but that's not TB. TB is my favorite program ever, but I'm not doing it anymore because it's not in line with my goals.
If you really do want to do TB I suggest you read both books in full, and maybe AA too since you're approaching your 40's. After you read them then you can start the program. If you have as much time as you say you should be able to knock out all books in less than a week.
The reason I say this is that none of the options you listed are in the books. For starters TB has you start with a lot of low intensity conditioning and only a little weight lifting; kind of the opposite of what you want to do. It's called Base Building. Also, none of the Operator or Zulu options you have below are set up like Operator or Zulu are set up in the book.
Like I said, you do whatever you want to do. But if you really want to do TB (I think you should!), read those books and then come back to us.
If you really do want to do TB I suggest you read both books in full, and maybe AA too since you're approaching your 40's. After you read them then you can start the program. If you have as much time as you say you should be able to knock out all books in less than a week.
The reason I say this is that none of the options you listed are in the books. For starters TB has you start with a lot of low intensity conditioning and only a little weight lifting; kind of the opposite of what you want to do. It's called Base Building. Also, none of the Operator or Zulu options you have below are set up like Operator or Zulu are set up in the book.
Like I said, you do whatever you want to do. But if you really want to do TB (I think you should!), read those books and then come back to us.
Re: Training Protocol Guidance
KBKeto wrote:Sorry about that. I fully get what you are saying. Here's a bit more detail that may be of help to y'all in helping me get started right.
I'm a 36 y/o male serving in the Army. Like I said in my first post - I am fortunate enough to be attending graduate school full time right now so I have free reign to decide how to physical fitness without Army PT in the mix.
My training goals right now are primarily to increase strength and power. I will shift this goal come ~January to a more blended focus but right now, it's purely about moving weight and getting stronger with a maintenance mix of conditioning.
My squat is currently at 275, bench at 210, and my deadlift at 315lbs. I can do ~5 strict pullups for 3 sets (not weighted).
What I was hoping to get some feedback on is how I should/could structure my programming for strength gain. I have the time to train 5-6 days a week at upwards of 2 hours a session (although I don't plan on that) ie. time is not a concern. The examples I posted were just that - examples. I created them by reading through the forums and seeing what other people were doing, plus from what I have read in the book thus far. I fully intend to read both books, but with that being said... I will be starting on the 21st after vacation and will not have finished the books by then. I will tweek as I go if I find something to be off from the principles.
I had a lot of success running TB for pure strength. I'm by no means an expert, but I recently reached a 300lb+ bench press using Operator, something that was beginning to seem like an impossibility at my age. Other programs (5/3/1 and Madcow, mostly) definitely helped get me in range, but it was TB that brought me home after a long plateau. With that, here's my 0.02;
Use Operator
Keep your cluster tight & simple; BP/SQ/DL/WPU
Don't do more than 2 cardio workouts a week
Do at least 4 sets per exercise, more when you can
Keep the accessory work to a minimum or none at all beyond what you get from conditioning
Put Base Building on hold until you get your strength in a favorable range
Eat. You should feel as bad missing a meal as you do missing a workout.
I actually think your lifting numbers are in the ideal range to benefit from Op or Op IA....but I'll ask this anyway; have you maxed out your linear gains?
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BlackPyjamas
- Posts: 137
- Joined: Sat Sep 10, 2016 2:52 am
Re: Training Protocol Guidance
This makes things easier!KBKeto wrote:Sorry about that. I fully get what you are saying. Here's a bit more detail that may be of help to y'all in helping me get started right.
I'm a 36 y/o male serving in the Army. Like I said in my first post - I am fortunate enough to be attending graduate school full time right now so I have free reign to decide how to physical fitness without Army PT in the mix.
My training goals right now are primarily to increase strength and power. I will shift this goal come ~January to a more blended focus but right now, it's purely about moving weight and getting stronger with a maintenance mix of conditioning.
My squat is currently at 275, bench at 210, and my deadlift at 315lbs. I can do ~5 strict pullups for 3 sets (not weighted).
What I was hoping to get some feedback on is how I should/could structure my programming for strength gain. I have the time to train 5-6 days a week at upwards of 2 hours a session (although I don't plan on that) ie. time is not a concern. The examples I posted were just that - examples. I created them by reading through the forums and seeing what other people were doing, plus from what I have read in the book thus far. I fully intend to read both books, but with that being said... I will be starting on the 21st after vacation and will not have finished the books by then. I will tweek as I go if I find something to be off from the principles.
1. Finish reading both books first as suggested by G2B.
2. I like Nomad's advice. To add to that; don't discount using Op I/A, or at least give yourself the option to go with higher volume (more sets) and an occasional extra rest day in-between.
3. I'd take that advice one step further even......don't do more than three exercises every Operator session should you go that route.
4. Use a training max. You should be able to complete your workout when you're tired, hungry, in a bad mood, or feeling like a weak shite.
5. Don't waste your time with retesting. Just force progression.
Re: Training Protocol Guidance
Agreed. You're going to be missing lots of vital information if you skip this. Just looking at a template without the background info will cause problems in the long run.Green2Blue wrote: Like I said, you do whatever you want to do. But if you really want to do TB (I think you should!), read those books and then come back to us.
Re: Training Protocol Guidance
Nomad wrote: You should feel as bad missing a meal as you do missing a workout.
Lol, this is so on point!
Re: Training Protocol Guidance
Great advice from the guys above.
If you want to use TB for strength then definitely use operator and keep things simple. I can kinda see what you were trying to do, but the strength gains come from the frequency of doing the lifts regularly using a training max. This gives your body plenty of time to recover and also maximize your time getting to work on that lift. You are trying to hit a few extra exercises because you are afraid that you will lose strength in them, but don't worry.
My favourite cluster is Back Squat, Bench and Weighted Pullup, I believe this is the best cluster for a strength orientated TB user. I can guarantee you will have no issues deadlifting if you squat heavy and also do heavy weighted pullups. Weighted Pullups have done more for my strength than any other exercise, I personally don't believe you need to do any deadlifting if you hit them heavy and hard.
Go with Op until you need the extra recovery and then use Op I/A. Use the above cluster unless you have issues doing those movements. Use different movements like cleans, overhead presses and rows in your HIC work if you feel the need to vary things. There is nothing wrong with using a dumbell or kettlebell and doing a couple of sets of the above with hill sprints for a HIC. If you can do loaded carries as a finisher and you should meet your goals.
Just my advice along with what everyone else has said, especially about finishing the books.
If you want to use TB for strength then definitely use operator and keep things simple. I can kinda see what you were trying to do, but the strength gains come from the frequency of doing the lifts regularly using a training max. This gives your body plenty of time to recover and also maximize your time getting to work on that lift. You are trying to hit a few extra exercises because you are afraid that you will lose strength in them, but don't worry.
My favourite cluster is Back Squat, Bench and Weighted Pullup, I believe this is the best cluster for a strength orientated TB user. I can guarantee you will have no issues deadlifting if you squat heavy and also do heavy weighted pullups. Weighted Pullups have done more for my strength than any other exercise, I personally don't believe you need to do any deadlifting if you hit them heavy and hard.
Go with Op until you need the extra recovery and then use Op I/A. Use the above cluster unless you have issues doing those movements. Use different movements like cleans, overhead presses and rows in your HIC work if you feel the need to vary things. There is nothing wrong with using a dumbell or kettlebell and doing a couple of sets of the above with hill sprints for a HIC. If you can do loaded carries as a finisher and you should meet your goals.
Just my advice along with what everyone else has said, especially about finishing the books.
Re: Training Protocol Guidance
Thanks everyone for chiming in with some good advice. I appreciate it. I was starting to worry that I was not going to get any advice other than to read the book haha
Yes - I purchased the 2 books and will definitely be reading them. I plan on reading a good portion/if not both of them on the way to and back from Orlando. But I will be getting back into the gym when I get back and wanted something to start with.
Thanks for the training advice - along with my reading of the books and this input I should be able to start out right and then adjust as I complete the books and get a better understanding of everything. I really appreciate the feedback.
"Like I said, you do whatever you want to do. But if you really want to do TB (I think you should!), read those books and then come back to us."
"1. Finish reading both books first as suggested by G2B."
"Agreed. You're going to be missing lots of vital information if you skip this. Just looking at a template without the background info will cause problems in the long run."
"Just my advice along with what everyone else has said, especially about finishing the books."
Yes - I purchased the 2 books and will definitely be reading them. I plan on reading a good portion/if not both of them on the way to and back from Orlando. But I will be getting back into the gym when I get back and wanted something to start with.
Use Operator
Keep your cluster tight & simple; BP/SQ/DL/WPU
Don't do more than 2 cardio workouts a week
Do at least 4 sets per exercise, more when you can
Keep the accessory work to a minimum or none at all beyond what you get from conditioning
Put Base Building on hold until you get your strength in a favorable range
Eat. You should feel as bad missing a meal as you do missing a workout.
2. I like Nomad's advice. To add to that; don't discount using Op I/A, or at least give yourself the option to go with higher volume (more sets) and an occasional extra rest day in-between.
3. I'd take that advice one step further even......don't do more than three exercises every Operator session should you go that route.
4. Use a training max. You should be able to complete your workout when you're tired, hungry, in a bad mood, or feeling like a weak shite.
5. Don't waste your time with retesting. Just force progression.
Thanks for the training advice - along with my reading of the books and this input I should be able to start out right and then adjust as I complete the books and get a better understanding of everything. I really appreciate the feedback.