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I just started my base building trying to follow the book as written. Today was my second LSS day and finally got outside to try the LSS run. It really ended up being a walk with some running mixed in. The question is that I have membership at a commercial gym, and the book stated that you can use other modalities other than a run, I assume to allow those with certain limitations to still get the work in. My limitation on the runs is that I suck at running I'm built like a hobbit, really need to loose some weight, one of my goals. I have access to a concept 2 rower and the other cardio paraphernalia at a commercial gym. The book states that that is ok, but my question is will that effect my end results. I'm a retired LEO, not an operator and my main goal is to become "HTK"/ hard to kill in the extreme sport of aging, I'm 57 now. I have read that on averages LEO's in general die within 5 years of retiring. So if I use the tower instead of running will I loose any benefit if BB other than not "greasing the groove" of runnng? In my weird way of rationalizing I would think that since I'm not a runner by trade it really shouldn't matter, but I figure should check with the more experienced for their input. Any input is appreciated.
Thanks
Mike

Mike, finally somebody my age joins the forum. Welcome.

I'm far from an expert on the conditioning stuff, but my understanding is that in terms of the heart benefits, the modality doesn't matter or doesn't matter much. As long as you get that heart rate level and maintain it, you should have that covered. If you go by the rule of don't do anything that might lead to having to lay off the training, you have a pretty good argument for not running. Rowing is pretty good so if you can do that consistently it seems like a winner.

Mike D wrote:I just started my base building trying to follow the book as written. Today was my second LSS day and finally got outside to try the LSS run. It really ended up being a walk with some running mixed in. The question is that I have membership at a commercial gym, and the book stated that you can use other modalities other than a run, I assume to allow those with certain limitations to still get the work in. My limitation on the runs is that I suck at running I'm built like a hobbit, really need to loose some weight, one of my goals. I have access to a concept 2 rower and the other cardio paraphernalia at a commercial gym. The book states that that is ok, but my question is will that effect my end results. I'm a retired LEO, not an operator and my main goal is to become "HTK"/ hard to kill in the extreme sport of aging, I'm 57 now. I have read that on averages LEO's in general die within 5 years of retiring. So if I use the tower instead of running will I loose any benefit if BB other than not "greasing the groove" of runnng? In my weird way of rationalizing I would think that since I'm not a runner by trade it really shouldn't matter, but I figure should check with the more experienced for their input. Any input is appreciated.
Thanks
Mike

Welcome aboard Mike D

I strongly recommend that you run (outside) for the majority of your LSS. Nothing really quite compares to the conditioning that straight up roadwork gives you regardless of how things are supposed to work in theory. A little more challenging at first but the rewards are worth it. That you're a little reluctant to do it suggests to me that you absolutely should do it. Especially with the goals you've outlined. Save the indoor LSS for days it's indoor-or-nothing (extreme weather, etc).

If you're struggling - cap all of your runs at 30 minutes. I think you'll get more benefit out of running on-the-ground for 30 minutes then you would by finding an indoor substitute for 45 or 60. Next time Base rolls around you'll be fit enough to go the full duration anyway. Walk/run if necessary - just stay within the prescribed heartrate zone.

TBPenguin wrote:Mike, finally somebody my age joins the forum. Welcome.

I'm far from an expert on the conditioning stuff, but my understanding is that in terms of the heart benefits, the modality doesn't matter or doesn't matter much. As long as you get that heart rate level and maintain it, you should have that covered. If you go by the rule of don't do anything that might lead to having to lay off the training, you have a pretty good argument for not running. Rowing is pretty good so if you can do that consistently it seems like a winner.

That's what I thought also. But I see that KB also responded with a different take on running. And the program is his and he did the research and leg work for the program so I have to respect his opinion over my rationalizing not wanting to run. During my LEO career I spent 12 years on the bomb squad as a bomb tech and EDD handler/trainer (explosive detection K9) and I was always amazed when we went on calls and others would always try to put their input on how we should handle the call and they were not bomb techs just regular officers wanting to adjust how we handled the call. Mostly to expedite the process they had no training but did not stop them from adding input on how to do a render safe. I think that kind of applies now, since KB wrote the program he is the SME (subject matter expert) compared to me at least . He believes I would be better served by running if possible and when I can't be outside then use the alternate indoor modalities. You and I had the same idea which leads me to think I wasn't way out in left field here. But the SME recommends different approach than I had thought and I will follow his advise. As far as the age thing goes that was pretty funny cuz when I thought that I would be the only grey beard on here. Guess that's not the case either. That makes me 0 for 2 today "Old Guys Rule!" Thanks for your input Sir!!

K.B. wrote:

Mike D wrote:I just started my base building trying to follow the book as written. Today was my second LSS day and finally got outside to try the LSS run. It really ended up being a walk with some running mixed in. The question is that I have membership at a commercial gym, and the book stated that you can use other modalities other than a run, I assume to allow those with certain limitations to still get the work in. My limitation on the runs is that I suck at running I'm built like a hobbit, really need to loose some weight, one of my goals. I have access to a concept 2 rower and the other cardio paraphernalia at a commercial gym. The book states that that is ok, but my question is will that effect my end results. I'm a retired LEO, not an operator and my main goal is to become "HTK"/ hard to kill in the extreme sport of aging, I'm 57 now. I have read that on averages LEO's in general die within 5 years of retiring. So if I use the tower instead of running will I loose any benefit if BB other than not "greasing the groove" of runnng? In my weird way of rationalizing I would think that since I'm not a runner by trade it really shouldn't matter, but I figure should check with the more experienced for their input. Any input is appreciated.
Thanks
Mike

Welcome aboard Mike D

I strongly recommend that you run (outside) for the majority of your LSS. Nothing really quite compares to the conditioning that straight up roadwork gives you regardless of how things are supposed to work in theory. A little more challenging at first but the rewards are worth it. That you're a little reluctant to do it suggests to me that you absolutely should do it. Especially with the goals you've outlined. Save the indoor LSS for days it's indoor-or-nothing (extreme weather, etc).

If you're struggling - cap all of your runs at 30 minutes. I think you'll get more benefit out of running on-the-ground for 30 minutes then you would by finding an indoor substitute for 45 or 60. Next time Base rolls around you'll be fit enough to go the full duration anyway. Walk/run if necessary - just stay within the prescribed heartrate zone.

KB thanks for the response. That makes sense I guess there is a reason that road work is the backbone to most boxers S&C programs. I will plugging along with the runs. That's why I asked the question because I can rationalize just about any position. Ill just have to deal with the running and hopefully consistency will improve my running skill/ability.
Thank you Sir
Mike

Mike D wrote: I see that KB also responded with a different take on running. And the program is his and he did the research and leg work for the program so I have to respect his opinion

Agreed 100%. And I am glad he set us straight.

Hey, this might be of interest http://tacticalbarbell.com/forum/viewto ... ?f=16&t=25

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Hey, this might be of interest http://tacticalbarbell.com/forum/viewto ... ?f=16&t=25

Awesome thanks for the link! Great read, I will have to do something similar for my runs.

Read all the above I have to give my statement as well:

I started BB several months after a knee surgery. When I started BB I had serious pain when running, even wenn only running for 30min LSS runs. So I did all my E sessions on an AIRDYNE and on a stationary bike. So far I have no comparison how it would have been with all running but I can tell, that I did some huge improvement on my AIRDYNE-work. It became easier and easier after the first weeks.

This week I started with week 6 of BB and my first HIC was FOBBIT Intervals. The 2 minutes on the AIRDYNE between the swings and snatches were easy, felt good. Still having pain I will have to do all my HIC work with exercises not including running.

I just wanted to state, that there are possibilities to follow TB strictly even without running. This will be far from optimal, but also a possibility. Like a worst case scenario.

Hellequin wrote:Read all the above I have to give my statement as well:

I started BB several months after a knee surgery. When I started BB I had serious pain when running, even wenn only running for 30min LSS runs. So I did all my E sessions on an AIRDYNE and on a stationary bike. So far I have no comparison how it would have been with all running but I can tell, that I did some huge improvement on my AIRDYNE-work. It became easier and easier after the first weeks.

This week I started with week 6 of BB and my first HIC was FOBBIT Intervals. The 2 minutes on the AIRDYNE between the swings and snatches were easy, felt good. Still having pain I will have to do all my HIC work with exercises not including running.

I just wanted to state, that there are possibilities to follow TB strictly even without running. This will be far from optimal, but also a possibility. Like a worst case scenario.

Hellequin thanks for your input! I hope you have a great recovery from the knee surgery. My wife had a full knee replacement done last month, so I have seen first hand the issues with recovery from a knee surgery. I think you and I are along the same line of thinking when it comes to the LSS. But I think the rub comes in when you account for a persons specific goal. I think that if my goal was overall fitness or cardio vascular health we are on the right track, but when I account for my specific goal of overall hardening/toughening against my fight with Father Time. The actual act of running is a better fit, but when I absolutely can not run for environmental reasons ( I live in the desert and it gets fucking hot this time of the year. It was 108 yesterday when I attempted my run) or medical reasons the indoor options are a good alternate. And as alternates for me they will not totally replace the Primary in function for my goal. There is a saying that has been attributed from David Goggins but I can not verify that he said it first. " Just do something that sucks very Day" well this will be my "sucks" but I will have to just chug along one foot in front of the other the best I can. A long time ago I use to run daily in formation when I was in the Army, even after drinking all night. Right now it is real easy to use age, hormones, time available and medical issues as an excuse to not do something hard. I've been doing it for awhile now and have gotten pretty good at it. Which is why I'm here, to break the pattern of quiting when it gets hard. But thank you for your input!!! This is what makes this forum really great for me, the wealth of knowledge and experience here. And they are not stingy with it. I think if I had a different goal you would be correct. So for now I will keep trying to run unless Mother Nature cock blocks me.
Thanks
Mike

Just adding my dos pesos by saying that BB has changed about everything that I thought I know about training.. Biggest surprise was that I can run. My ability to run increased dramatically during my first BB couple of years ago. I have jumped from “running” with painfully slow 30 min to comfortable 90 min jog within same BB. That was amazing. Also, I was coming of long nasty injury recovery. Continuation was a blessing on top of that.

You will surprise yourself. Promise. Good luck!