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Since SE technically falls under "E" in the vault, can you do SE circuits on an E day during Black Protocol (professional or standard)? Like this;

D1 Op
D2 HIC
D3 Op
D4 HIC
D5 Op
D6 SE Circuits
D7 OFF

Why not? Wouldn't it be similar to a Fun-run? My SE circuits feel very much like a cardio session at times. Seems like a really convenient way to get some SE in.

Saracen wrote:Since SE technically falls under "E" in the vault, can you do SE circuits on an E day during Black Protocol (professional or standard)? Like this;

D1 Op
D2 HIC
D3 Op
D4 HIC
D5 Op
D6 SE Circuits
D7 OFF

Why not? Wouldn't it be similar to a Fun-run? My SE circuits feel very much like a cardio session at times. Seems like a really convenient way to get some SE in.

It sounds like SE might be like E doesn't it? But surprisingly enough it's not the same thing. E needs to be things like LSS, triples, fun runs, etc. TB III has a chapter on how to program SE if you enjoy SE.

Good luck!

Saracen wrote:Since SE technically falls under "E" in the vault, can you do SE circuits on an E day during Black Protocol (professional or standard)? Like this;

D1 Op
D2 HIC
D3 Op
D4 HIC
D5 Op
D6 SE Circuits
D7 OFF

Why not? Wouldn't it be similar to a Fun-run? My SE circuits feel very much like a cardio session at times. Seems like a really convenient way to get some SE in.

Interesting. I don't see why you couldn't do this once in a while... although I probably wouldn't make a habit of it. The only downside I see is that it might pre-fatigue your muscles for upcoming max-strength work, but then again you've got that rest day in between. How long do your SE sessions last? That might be a deciding factor too; if they don't go the distance for at least 30 minutes.

Saracen wrote:Since SE technically falls under "E" in the vault, can you do SE circuits on an E day during Black Protocol (professional or standard)? Like this;

D1 Op
D2 HIC
D3 Op
D4 HIC
D5 Op
D6 SE Circuits
D7 OFF

Why not? Wouldn't it be similar to a Fun-run? My SE circuits feel very much like a cardio session at times. Seems like a really convenient way to get some SE in.

Well it is categorized as E in TB2, and they do keep you moving continuously for the most part. Once in a while might be ok with the following caveats;

1. Use bodyweight exercises only. Barbell or weighted movements might cause too much DOMs and screw up your next Operator session. You might be able to get away with light KB swings.

2. Use "A" circuits

3. Should last a minimum of 30 mins

Personally I'd do a Fun-Run or Fobbit Interval instead, you can squeeze a lot of SE in with both.

DocOctagon wrote:Personally I'd do a Fun-Run or Fobbit Interval instead, you can squeeze a lot of SE in with both.

I go extreme on different direction and treat FunRun as a HIC and just started use it on HIC day. I do like it as safe compromise. I might be wrong, though..

Something similar to this has been rattling around in my head.

A lot of the free race training plans available on the internet will list out the run distances for the week and then leave you with 1-2 "cross training" days per week where you are given a time hack during which you are supposed to perform "cardio other than running". And they don't mean HIC, they mean LSS.

Going to the gym/pool for alternate cardio doesn't fit into my life, time management wise. But...a 1-2 SE sessions per week at night? Yeah, that might work...

Everyone should do what they believe is best for them. The best program you can do is the one you'll actually do right? If it's SE or nothing for your E day, SE might be better.

But I don't think SE serves the same purpose of regular E training. Regular E adds consistent aerobic work to your training. SE is not aerobic, it's anaerobic.

In TB III SE is utilized as an occasional replacement for MS work, because they're similar anaerobic domains. Even in base building you do 2 SE per week and 3 E. I'm pretty sure that wasn't to be interpreted as doing 5 SE's per week.

Just my opinion, and I'm often wrong. I'm sure for most people it won't make a massive difference.

I could be wrong, but the way I understand it is that SE is more of a workout for the muscles rather than cardio. Instead of training the muscles for maximum load like with Op template, you train them for repeated efforts/muscle endurance. Wouldn't the conditioning aspect of it just be a side effect? Some people huff and puff pretty hard doing heavy squats, doesn't necessarily make it an ideal cardio session though.

Nomad wrote:I could be wrong, but the way I understand it is that SE is more of a workout for the muscles rather than cardio. Instead of training the muscles for maximum load like with Op template, you train them for repeated efforts/muscle endurance. Wouldn't the conditioning aspect of it just be a side effect? Some people huff and puff pretty hard doing heavy squats, doesn't necessarily make it an ideal cardio session though.

I'm no expert but this is how I understood it as well. As more of a strength & muscle thing, not cardio. I don't see why you wouldn't do a Fun-Run or Fobbit Interval instead. Cycle in bodyweight exercises in between jogging intervals...

Nomad wrote:I could be wrong, but the way I understand it is that SE is more of a workout for the muscles rather than cardio. Instead of training the muscles for maximum load like with Op template, you train them for repeated efforts/muscle endurance. Wouldn't the conditioning aspect of it just be a side effect? Some people huff and puff pretty hard doing heavy squats, doesn't necessarily make it an ideal cardio session though.

Quite right..... especially in regard to the Heavy Squat analogy...... Aerobic Endurance is different to Strength endurance....... One of the factors concerning Aerobic endurance is veinous return, and left ventricle volume.

In regard to strength endurance, since the application of strength by a muscle necessitates a fraction of a second closure or near closure of the blood vessels in the muscles concerned and subsequently, due to other processes [Intra Thoracic Pressure], squeezing or closure of the 2 main veins responsible for carrying blood back to the heart thus hindering return to the heart which is in direct oppostion of what needs to happen for the 'Aerobic' aspect of endurance training, [It's a lot more complicated than this, and would require a lot more writing on my part - let's just say Kenneth Jay wrote quite a bit about this. - Cardio Code is the tome, but there will be other articles written by him in connection with this..... Andrew Read and Alex Viada also wrote on this subject.]

Actually, it is also the reason I tend to steer away from swings and 'lifting weights faster' to increase my Aerobic fitness. [This is a change in philosphy on my part over the last 4 years or so.... I had bought into the Swings are the answer to everything and 'what the heck' effect for a number of years, without fully looking into the physiology side of things closely.... in fact it was down to the works of Alex Viada that led to a change in my thinking]

Don't get me wrong, there will be a benefit to aerobic training from swings, snatches etc, but they will not be as good as Rowing, Running, Cycling, skiiing....... choosing the right tools for the job..... and keeping the goal the goal is of importance.

Apologies for getting somewhat technical, it's not usually my style