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After reading a bit, I may have hit it a little too hard.

Background, I am almost 43 y.o., professional FF (24/48 schedule) and just finished my 3rd cycle of operator (TBII). I bought the conditioning book, but I have not read it yet but intend to start protocol by next month. I like operator a lot, would like to in cooperate the cardio. Right now I do some cycling and kettlebell work.

Max lifts are deadlit 320 x 5, bench 235 x 4, pendalay row 195 x 2. I set the TM @ 90%.
Dead lift follow 3x5 (i.e minimum sets), bench and pendalay row are both 5x5 (max sets).

3rd cycle of operator. The first 2 cycles were great, added 6-7 lbs a month on bench and pendalay row and even more on deadlift.

The 3rd cycle I just did a retest and got about the same numbers or below. It is my 3rd operator in a row. I now know I should deload more.
I hit quite a wall in last 3 week of current cycle. I was struggling to hit my bench reps the last 3 weeks, when I had no problem at all hitting them the first 9 weeks.

My question is, when I deload do I just do those 3 exercises at 50% of my max? Also, when is the best time to deload. After every 6 week cycle, 12 week cycle?

When forcing progression how much do I add? I already round up, if bench press that day is 176 I do 180 for reps.

Thanks. Just a bit discouraged after making progress.

It sounds like you haven't read the 3rd edition (?). If not, I very strongly recommend reading it, 2nd ed is obsolete. All your questions are answered in great detail, and additionally you're going to want to take a good hard look at Op I/A.

Second, stop retesting. Force progression. 5lb-10lb. It's not apparent from your post if you understand what forced progression is...the weight is added to your 1Rmax's, not to your individual sessions. Also stop rounding up during individual sessions, if anything you should round down.

I read over the 3rd version. That is why I went from a 3x3 on the set to a 3x5. I understand forced progression. I add the # to my max, then I take the training max. Just curious what many use. I probably should reread the 3rd book more closely, but it was very similar to the 2nd.

I started to have back issues when my 1 rep squat got around 350lbs. I want to run Op1/a, but I need to get my core stronger and fix my technique on squats.

I round up on the weight due to my gym doesn't have fractional plates. I figure that I have a little wiggle room due to the fact that I use 90% TM.

29bearcat wrote:After reading a bit, I may have hit it a little too hard.

Background, I am almost 43 y.o., professional FF (24/48 schedule) and just finished my 3rd cycle of operator (TBII). I bought the conditioning book, but I have not read it yet but intend to start protocol by next month. I like operator a lot, would like to in cooperate the cardio. Right now I do some cycling and kettlebell work.

Max lifts are deadlit 320 x 5, bench 235 x 4, pendalay row 195 x 2. I set the TM @ 90%.
Dead lift follow 3x5 (i.e minimum sets), bench and pendalay row are both 5x5 (max sets).

3rd cycle of operator. The first 2 cycles were great, added 6-7 lbs a month on bench and pendalay row and even more on deadlift.

The 3rd cycle I just did a retest and got about the same numbers or below. It is my 3rd operator in a row. I now know I should deload more.
I hit quite a wall in last 3 week of current cycle. I was struggling to hit my bench reps the last 3 weeks, when I had no problem at all hitting them the first 9 weeks.

My question is, when I deload do I just do those 3 exercises at 50% of my max? Also, when is the best time to deload. After every 6 week cycle, 12 week cycle?

When forcing progression how much do I add? I already round up, if bench press that day is 176 I do 180 for reps.

Thanks. Just a bit discouraged after making progress.

X2 on Aelian's take.

Here are a few more thoughts:

(a) I recommend that during a deload week (unless you are a complete beginner) that you don't touch the weights during a deload week. Do other stuff (E, GC, sports, etc.), but nothing hard. Take it easy.

(b) For a guy your age (my age), deload at least after each six-week block, and serious consider deloading after every three week wave. See AA on this.

(c) Round your numbers down.

(d) If you are having a hard time hitting your numbers, lower your training max. See the "Old Warhorse Template" in AA for a systematic way of manipulating your TM in this way.

Just one more proponent of:

1. Forced progression over retesting. This is big. I feel like testing only needs to be used when you first start. Testing is too stressful, and testing numbers are too fickle. You could be basing your entire block off one good or bad day. It also doesn't encourage slow, steady progress.
2. Deloads every 6 weeks at minimum, or every 3 if you need it.
3. If you're really, truly beat down, do the OWH template. It works. I did it, and then hit a PR a week later.

Thanks, I was just trying to get an idea of what most people do. I have not had any trouble hitting the numbers, except for the past 3 weeks. But I felt a lot of fatigue in those 3 weeks. I may have fried my CNS a bit by overdoing it, or just a combo of my job/projects. Doing 3 - 12 week cycles without much of a break was too much I guess.

So, I will deload every 6 weeks and see how that works for me.

I will work on forced progressions.

I will buy a few fractional plates.

Thanks for the advice.

Not to pile on, but I am going to agree with the following suggestions that have already been given:

1) Use Op I/A starting at a 90% TM.
2) Work up using forced progression.
3) Try taking a deload/easy week after every 9 Op I/A sessions. This will be somewhere between 3-4 weeks. It really does make a difference.
4) I trust J-Madd, but on my deload weeks, I am still doing 3 sets of 5 at 40/50/60% of TM hitting each exercise at least once that week. It helps me to groove the movement patterns at a lower intensity. So if my cluster is BP/SQ/ WCU/DL(every 3rd session) then I might do 3 workouts that week and they may look like this: 1) BP/DL at deload percentages and some light jogging, 2) SQ/WCU at deload percentages and some light jogging (if I can't deload WCU's enough to do them at bodyweight I'll skip them), and 3) a half GC or maybe a longish slow run at a very comfortable pace. However, if I feel like I need to completely get away from the weights, I will.

Just my $.02, and it's working for me.

mikhou

29bearcat wrote:Thanks, I was just trying to get an idea of what most people do. I have not had any trouble hitting the numbers, except for the past 3 weeks. But I felt a lot of fatigue in those 3 weeks. I may have fried my CNS a bit by overdoing it, or just a combo of my job/projects. Doing 3 - 12 week cycles without much of a break was too much I guess.

So, I will deload every 6 weeks and see how that works for me.

I will work on forced progressions.

I will buy a few fractional plates.

Thanks for the advice.

All the advice in this thread is gold. I have a slightly different suggestion. Just keep doing what you're doing, keep everything the same, except force progression. Every single block for the rest of your training life is not going to result in significant improvement. You mentioned you were under added pressure & fatigue for this one. Sometimes the body just takes longer to get used to heavier loads the stronger you get. Give it another try and see how your next block turns out...after all you've been very successful so far doing what you've been doing.

There are several ways to deload.

Do nothing. Do some other light activity. Cut volume, cut weight, or both. I personally like the idea of keeping my lifts "grooved" as Mikhou suggested, but with drastically reduced volume (40%-50%).

mikhou wrote: 4) I trust J-Madd, but on my deload weeks, I am still doing 3 sets of 5 at 40/50/60% of TM hitting each exercise at least once that week.

DocOctagon wrote:[I personally like the idea of keeping my lifts "grooved" as Mikhou suggested, but with drastically reduced volume (40%-50%).

I agree that this is definitely not a wrong answer. I don't do it mainly because by the time I get to a deload week, I'm really sick of lifting weights. I need just to stay away from the barbells for a few days. That's the downside of doing this for thirty years.

J-Madd wrote: I agree that this is definitely not a wrong answer. I don't do it mainly because by the time I get to a deload week, I'm really sick of lifting weights. I need just to stay away from the barbells for a few days. That's the downside of doing this for thirty years.

I can't argue with that. No one is going to lose any strength by not touching barbells for a week. And for many it's probably the best idea in order to come back totally fresh. I do it occasionally, just not regularly.

mikhou