Deadlift Woes

[Carlos]

Hello,

I'm having a very frustrating issue. The day after deadlifts I feel jittery, anxious, spaced out and a touch depressed. I'm very certain it's the deadlifts doing this, but of course can't be 100% sure. This has been an issue for me pre-TB as well. I stopped DL'ng last year, and recently brought it back into my Zulu template 1 x week.

Is this normal? Something to do with the CNS? It usually happens when I do more than one set, but it's happened after one work set days as well. I'm not DL'ng that heavy either, 225 - 350lbs.

Would really really appreciate input from anyone else that has experience with this. I'm considering just dropping DLs, which would be a shame because they do seem to boost my strength. Is this something that will eventually go away?

[J-Madd]

I have a hard time with frequent DL, but it's not a CNS issue for me - my back just need time between sessions. What you are describing sounds like what people experience when they get into CNS trouble with the DL. If that's your hunch about what is going on, I have no reason to question it. Before you cut out the DL entirely, here are some other things to try:

(a) How heavy is your conditioning load? If you are doing lots of sprints, that can be pretty taxing too. You might see whether you can tighten up on that front.

(b) You might try playing with a very conservative training max with you DL; maybe even 85% or less. Some people make progress in the DL even just pulling singles in the 65-75% range.

(c) Consider DLing on a ten day schedule, instead of a seven day schedule.

(d) Some people find shorter ROM DL variations are more CNS friendly. I'm not sure about that, but it deserves to be mentioned.

(E) How many lifts are in your cluster? Maybe cutting down on the overall volume of barbell lifts would help.

(f) You might see whether using something like a FSQ/OHP/Bodyweight PU cluster with the DL is less taxing than the traditional Bg Four. You could switch blocks between good FSQ/OHP/BW PU/ DL and SQ/BP/WPU/Rows every few blocks.

In the end, if you just can't find a home for the DL (though I doubt it will come to that), you can very strong and balanced with lots of heavy swings and loaded carries.

I hope this helps.

[Balaclava]

"jittery" and "anxious" sounds like classic sympathetic overtraining.

[grouchyjarhead]

Post all the details of your last week of training. Also give us some insight on your diet, sleep habits, and what you do for recovery. This sounds more like an over training issue from just what you described here so far.

[Carlos]

I have a hard time with frequent DL, but it's not a CNS issue for me - my back just need time between sessions. What you are describing sounds like what people experience when they get into CNS trouble with the DL. If that's your hunch about what is going on, I have no reason to question it. Before you cut out the DL entirely, here are some other things to try:

(a) How heavy is your conditioning load? If you are doing lots of sprints, that can be pretty taxing too. You might see whether you can tighten up on that front.

(b) You might try playing with a very conservative training max with you DL; maybe even 85% or less. Some people make progress in the DL even just pulling singles in the 65-75% range.

(c) Consider DLing on a ten day schedule, instead of a seven day schedule.

(d) Some people find shorter ROM DL variations are more CNS friendly. I'm not sure about that, but it deserves to be mentioned.

(E) How many lifts are in your cluster? Maybe cutting down on the overall volume of barbell lifts would help.

(f) You might see whether using something like a FSQ/OHP/Bodyweight PU cluster with the DL is less taxing than the traditional Bg Four. You could switch blocks between good FSQ/OHP/BW PU/ DL and SQ/BP/WPU/Rows every few blocks.

In the end, if you just can't find a home for the DL (though I doubt it will come to that), you can very strong and balanced with lots of heavy swings and loaded carries.

I hope this helps.

Thanks J-Madd:

a) My conditioning is inconsistent right now, low-moderate if I had to guess. Now that you mention it I lose libido almost completely for a day or two after a LISS run too. I haven't been consistent enough with my conditioning to be sure though.

b) I think I'll give this a try. If it doesn't work I'll try DL'ng only once every second week.

e) I have 4 lifts in my zulu cluster: Squat, BP, SOHP, DL and bodyweight chin-ups in sets of 5 either as a finisher or in between sets.

Thanks again!

[Carlos]

Post all the details of your last week of training. Also give us some insight on your diet, sleep habits, and what you do for recovery. This sounds more like an over training issue from just what you described here so far.

Thanks. I finished week 2 of Zulu:

Sept 27 - Squat 255 x 5 x 3, SOHP 115 x 5 x 3, Bodyweight pull-ups 5 x 3
Sept 28 - BP 205 4 sets x 3 reps, DL 3 x 3 255
Sept 29 - Off
Sept 30 - Squat 255 x 5 x 3, SOHP 115 x 5 x 3
Oct 1 - 3 x 10 kettlebell swings 32kg
Oct 2 - BP 205lbs x 3 x 3, 225 x 2 x 3
DL: 3 x 135, 2 x 225, 2 x 255, 2 x 255, 2 x 255 (255 = work sets)
Toes to Bar 2 x 5, Knees to Elbows 2 x 10

Did nothing for the last two days and today I feel fine. Yesterday I felt like total crap, felt anxious as hell and shaky. Today I actually feel very good. But I haven't done anything physical.

Sleep - roughly in bed by 2300hrs, up by around 0600hrs. I'm not the best sleeper, I do wake up occasionally throughout the night.

Diet - I don't really count calories, just eat 4-5 meals a day. 30-50 grams protein along with a serving of carbohydrate like rice or potatoes. Chicken and rice, turkey burgers (with bread), high protein muffins, and even a couple burgers.

[Carlos]

Forgot to mention I've been using 500mg-1000mg tyrosine this past week, in the mornings on an empty stomach. I also used 15mg of zinc picolinate the night before I felt like total shite.

[Barkadion]

Post all the details of your last week of training. Also give us some insight on your diet, sleep habits, and what you do for recovery. This sounds more like an over training issue from just what you described here so far.

Thanks. I finished week 2 of Zulu:

Sept 27 - Squat 255 x 5 x 3, SOHP 115 x 5 x 3, Bodyweight pull-ups 5 x 3
Sept 28 - BP 205 4 sets x 3 reps, DL 3 x 3 255
Sept 29 - Off
Sept 30 - Squat 255 x 5 x 3, SOHP 115 x 5 x 3
Oct 1 - 3 x 10 kettlebell swings 32kg
Oct 2 - BP 205lbs x 3 x 3, 225 x 2 x 3
DL: 3 x 135, 2 x 225, 2 x 255, 2 x 255, 2 x 255 (255 = work sets)
Toes to Bar 2 x 5, Knees to Elbows 2 x 10

Did nothing for the last two days and today I feel fine. Yesterday I felt like total crap, felt anxious as hell and shaky. Today I actually feel very good. But I haven't done anything physical.

Sleep - roughly in bed by 2300hrs, up by around 0600hrs. I'm not the best sleeper, I do wake up occasionally throughout the night.

Diet - I don't really count calories, just eat 4-5 meals a day. 30-50 grams protein along with a serving of carbohydrate like rice or potatoes. Chicken and rice, turkey burgers (with bread), high protein muffins, and even a couple burgers.

I don't know your personal situation but I just want to share my experience. Supplements are not miracle and it can't replace proper food. But. Sometimes. Being in training can make you be in need of certain micro elements.

Personally, I found that thanking magnesium helps me a lot in both dimensions: recovery and relaxation. And yes, sleep.

You might want to run blood work and analyze your chemistry.
Also, make sure you are not dehydrated.

Good luck, mate!

[grouchyjarhead]

Have you tried reducing your deadlifting frequency to just once a week? Because in one week you pulled heavy twice and did kettlebell swings which could be a part of it. Have you tried just one work set of deadlifts once a week?

If you're training hard you do need more sleep so if you can at least fit in a nap that might help as well.

[J-Madd]

Have you tried reducing your deadlifting frequency to just once a week? Because in one week you pulled heavy twice and did kettlebell swings which could be a part of it. Have you tried just one work set of deadlifts once a week?

If you're training hard you do need more sleep so if you can at least fit in a nap that might help as well.

X2 on what Grouchy said. Cut way down on DL and see whether the problem goes away. Later you can always add back in some DL volume incrementally until you find the threshold.